Caroline Blair:
Hello, I'm Caroline Blair and I'm delighted to welcome you to SP Energy Networks’ Powering Conversations podcast, where we are bringing together experts in the energy industry to discuss the rapidly evolving energy transition to revolutionise the electricity network for a net zero future. We know that climate change is increasingly impacting us and how important tackling it is for society. Reaching net zero is a crucial goal, and the electricity network plays a key part in this.
We are seeing a once in a generation transformation, and in each episode we'll bring you insightful conversations with experts, in-depth discussions on the latest trends, and practical tips to help you understand and navigate this change. In our first episode then, we are setting the scene and delving into the evolution ahead of us for our electricity network. So on this podcast, I'm thrilled to be joined by Scott Mathison, Network Planning and Regulation Director at SP energy Networks, Kathleen Davis, commercial director at the Power Networks Demonstration Centre, which for the purposes of this podcast, will refer to as the PNDC, and Dave Roberts, Chief Technology Officer for EA technology. Thank you all for being here. It's great to have you today. And incredible titles. So I hope you don't mind, let's go back to the beginning and unpack a bit about exactly what your role is.
Scott, starting with yourself and your capacity as Network Planning and regulation director at SP Energy Networks. What exactly does your role involve?
Scott Mathieson:
So my role, I guess you could describe us as the system architects for the transmission distribution network, a role and responsibility we’re very proud to take on.
So what do we do? We are planning for the future and the needs of the transmission and distribution network as it needs to become more integrated in terms of how it operates. We're seeing a difference in the way the electricity system is used and utilised. Domestic consumers are not only using the power that we distribute, they're actually exporting power onto that grid, and we're sending it all across the country.
So our job, my job is to make sure that we're planning effectively for the needs of those consumers as we move forward, both in terms of the renewable generation that we're seeking to connect to the grid, but increasingly also satisfying their demand for electric vehicles, air source heat pumps, electrification of heating systems and also, and hopefully we'll talk about it today, is supporting the opportunity for growth and other businesses and technologies that we require on the grid.
So my job is to try and put that together, try and make sure that we invest and intellect within this business, but also connect with intellectual growth opportunity outside of this business.
Caroline Blair:
So very much a recognition then of the dual direction of how power is given and received now as a key part of your role and of course, the impact of the growth of, and the change that where the evolution within where we are at at the moment in this transformation.
So onto yourself then. Where do you fit into this in terms of your role as commercial director at the Power Networks Demonstration Centre? What exactly is that centre about?
Kathleen Davis:
Okay, so the PNDC, which is the power networks demonstration centreas you mentioned, that's one of the University of Strathclyde's key industry facing centres. And the industry facing centres are primarily there to translate research and that really fundamental thinking and validate those ideas in a safe, controlled environment.
So we were set up in partnership with our network operator partners, one of which is Scottish Power Energy Networks. And really, they wanted a safe, controllable environment to derisk and validate these these net zero solutions so that they can accelerate the commercialisation of those either time to market or gain on evidence base that they need to see, you know, just technologies fit for purpose and we're happy to deploy this at scale and throughout the network.
Now being part of the university, we've got a really exciting role because we work across a supply chain. So not only with the network operators, but with system integrators, high potential growth SMEs, UK catapult centres, for example. So really valuable insights which we can learn, take and then share that with technology solution providers to accelerate that net zero transition.
Caroline Blair:
So in connecting your role, I suppose, with Scott’s and with SP Energy Networks, you're ultimately a bit of a testing ground, a trial ground for the end product that we see with SP Energy Networks and then onto yourself. Then, Dave, where do you fit this fit into this picture? What's your role within?
Dave Roberts:
So we're EA Technology and so we're a solution provider for owners and operators of power networks. So we've been around since the late 1960s working very much in in the context of looking at end of life assets. So when electrical asset start to reach the end of life, when do you invest in them to make sure that you can keep them going for as long as you can.
In the last five years, we brought to market a number of digitalisation solutions so that monitoring systems, that's software systems for giving you insights into how the grid is operating and really supporting the decarbonisation. And we particularly focus around the low voltage grid. So low voltage grid is the bit that feeds most of our homes, in fact, all of our homes, many of our businesses. Yet it's the it's one of the dumbest parts of the grid. So really digitalising that and is crucial for us to get towards net zero.
Caroline Blair:
So if we were describing and to keep, keep me on track here, if we were describing it, we discussed roads effectively. You have your motorways, you have your A roads, your B roads – these would be your B and C roads?
Dave Roberts:
Absolutely. The B and C roads are the ones that feed all of our homes. That's pretty much the best analogy. So everyone thinks about the motorways, the big transmission systems that march across the country. And that's super important. But also, equally important are the ones that actually take it right the way to our to our home on the simple analogy that we use there is, if you think about your own home or the home of your parents, think about how old that home is. The grid that feeds your house is at least as old as your house. So if you're living in a 1980s house that is a 40 year old asset, if you're living in a 1960s house, that's a 60 year old asset. If you're in the 1920s or earlier a house that's a hundred year old asset that is still operating in the background silently to make sure that the grid is powering your home.
And what we're trying to do is get much more out of that existing asset and utilise that asset in a new way. As we start to plug in electric cars, plug in heat pumps and put photovoltaics onto our roofs.
Caroline Blair:
So we'll stick with you at this point then. When we talk about the once in a generation transformation of the network, this is peak season for you, then this is an incredibly busy time. But ultimately there's a huge need and requirement for the digitisation as well. And bringing in those aspects.
Dave Roberts:
Absolutely. I mean, if we take this up a level, the, the, the drive towards decarbonised, generation across all voltages, across all levels is super important because once we decarbonise the way that we generate our electricity, it allows us then to use that, that greener energy for other things.
So decarbonisation of heat with heat pumps, decarbonisation of transport with electric vehicles, they're critical for us as we start to decarbonize the generation mix, which the UK is on a huge amount of actually in the last 20, 10 years. But absolutely, we're seeing more of this change now happening over the, over the coming years. And particularly it's being driven by you and me as consumers. It's citizens. It's one street versus another street. It's it's down to the conversations we have in the pub about when you might change your car. And I'll give you another interesting, pointer, which is that one electric vehicle driving an average amount of miles per year uses the same amount of energy in one year as one house.
Caroline Blair:
Wow. Let's unpack that.
Dave Roberts:
So we’ve done lots of real world trials, and it doesn't matter whether people have got very long range vehicles, a very short range vehicles, typically what we see is that the energy demand in kilowatt hours is the same over a year for one car as they use in one house. It's a simple analogy, but it’s a really powerful one. We've got 26 million homes in Great Britain. We've got about 32 million cars in Great Britain.
As we electrify our cars, that's almost like doubling the housing stock. We've got to make sure the power can get to those vehicles and those homes at the right points.
Caroline Blair:
Scott, we're getting a really clear picture of the scale of the operation. And if we're talking about even just homes and cars, it's a very tangible example of the impact and I suppose in large ways, the need we've covered the need to to do this. But the scale of this is not insignificant.
Scott Mathieson:
No, Dave has set it out very well. And I guess there's a number of aspects I would like to emphasise, as well as that transformation that Dave has talked about in terms of the doubling of demand is what we do going forward and the distribution networks need to be able to support. But remember that that’s actually getting is away from a dependency in oil and gas. So there's a net benefit to the consumer. And I think it's really important that we don't lose sight of that. Is that there's a reason that we're trying to make sure the electricity network can deliver that doubling of demand.
We developed and we settle our investment programs and our incomes and our, our plans and our commitments to our consumers through a thing called the price control. Simplest way to think about that is a contract that we have with the consumer to deliver certain outcomes. One of the key ones for me is one we describe as the home of the future is that we need to be planning for the change in the housing stock that Dave has described that needs to happen for a network that can support a charger for an electric vehicle which will be doubling demand but air source heat pumps that Dave didn’t touch on.
So, there’s a thing called the after diversity maximum demand, which is simple tool will we used to plan our low voltage networks. Traditionally 2.5kW is what we use is the assumption for each contribution from each household, o average, during the course of a 24 hour period. When you had an electric vehicle, as Dave says, that goes to about five.
But when you add in potential, an air source heat pump, it jumps up to 9 or 10kW. So one of the big things for us.
Caroline Blair:
That is significant, it’s a very, very different picture.
Scott Mathieson:
Very, very significant. And the architecture, it's not just about the age of the architecture actually in Britain what we've got is a very low cost electricity system that was designed to keep prices and costs down, and it has done so very successfully in comparison to Europe or use the system charges are relatively low to European peers, but we did that by sharing capacity in some instances between homes or what we call loop services, so basically the physical capacity, electricity capacity that a home has is halved and shared with the neighbour, and that keeps the cost down. And that would mean that that neighbour would have about nine kilowatts. And then a world where you had your average demands two and a half. That's more than sufficient then overall for you popping up to 11kW before I’ve counted that fact that your hob, your oven, your shower, could be on simultaneously with your car charger, that’s just not enough and we need to make sure that we invest in that network. So there is a revolution, as I describe it, going on in low voltage networks. But the problem for us at SP Energy Networks, and Dave's characterised it really well, is that same revolution is happening at 400,000 volts on the transmission network at the level of renewables that we've got, and we have to integrate.
Scotland's maximum demand in winter there's about five gigawatts, but we have 12GW of renewables connected on to the system, and we have to get that into the bigger market in England and Wales. But that renewables is intermittent generation and it's moving about and it's changing dependent on the weather patterns, which means that the network and how it responds has to be much more able to deal with sudden changes.
Caroline Blair:
Robust. It has to be incredibly robust.
Scott Mathieson:
Exactly. And there's a big debate, just to bring this around as well about storage and the role it has to play. We often see large batteries now connecting on our distribution networks as well, which again why things like VisNet are so vitally important as well. So they're great. They can allow us to increase demand at certain points of time where we have an oversupply from renewable generation, absorb that and avoid constraint costs on distribution as well as transmission networks. But they dispatch and 10 to 20 milliseconds and a 50 megawatt battery can effectively ramp down and ramp up from moving from import to export. So create 100MW of change in 20 milliseconds. And our networks need to respond to that and we haven't had enough research historically on what does that actually do to things like transformers, key components of the network that we operate.
Caroline Blair:
Which is where, Kathleen, I assume you come in as well, because this is part of the information that you can help collate and gather?
Kathleen Davis:
Absolutely, it's really exciting to be in innovation I would say at this time because there's certainly enough needed, I think, for the challenges that we've got ahead.
Scott and Dave mentioned that, you know, a fundamental redesign really is needed of the network. So we had, it was designed for one way power. So from power stations to homes that now we're going to have small energy producers, solar, storage at scale, for example. So how do we make the the network flexible to be able to cope with that and we've been doing a lot of programmes in that area with our innovation partners at PNDC. Also, as well is that, we have aging infrastructure. So how do we make that change? And the analogy I always use as you're renovating your kitchen, for example, you don't rip it all out once. You want to maintain some essential functions there, like the cooker or the microwave, or you have one going at a time, or no one's getting dinner that night, right?
So you need a phased approach to that. You need to maintain continuous power. Are the dinners being made every evening? And that's really complex to manage all that and ensure that consumers still have continuous operation and power through that, they can't pause that energy needs. So again, as trying to create an evidence base for our partners of when is at a time to do that, and how does that fit in with the investment decisions and plans I think is another really exciting thing for us.
Both Scott and Dave mentioned the mass roll out of electric vehicles and heat pumps as well. So, you know, most estimates predict that you need 2 to 3 times capacity by 2050. I mean, that's huge. But it's also huge because we don't quite understand how consumer behaviour impacts any of that as well.
So we've been trying to work with Energy Systems Catapult on what we call the whole energy systems accelerator. And we have 11 labs throughout and it's basically loving homes, which renewable technologies installed in different homes around the UK. And what they try to do is get that consumer insight, pass it to us so that we can then put it through a different network scenarios at PNDC to try and again give some insights to our partners on that as well.
Caroline Blair:
To gather the data that you need to predict how best to tackle it? Because this is a live issue, isn't it? We have a target, we have 2050. This is an ongoing issue. It has to. There's no hiding away from it. It has to be done.
One of the descriptors I heard that I found to be incredibly powerful was that the current transformation to the electricity network is one of the biggest infrastructure challenges in Britain since World War two, and I think that gives a real indication of the scale. So let's now think about the consumer and the impact that that has on you as an individual. What do we need to anticipate? Because we need power. We do have our devices. I mean my home, it feels like it's a it's a tech shop at this point with the family. You do you have. And as we've talked about the various different air source heat pumps, you've got different ways of contributing and taking back from the grid. So what is the impact on the consumer?
Dave Roberts:
Yeah, I think there's a number of points we've already talked about, which is really important to to make it very clear that we've got to keep the lights on, we've got to keep the existing system running. So there's a lot of change that is going to be happening in the background, but it's got to maintain that continuity throughout that change.
So understanding how capacity is moving at different times of day becomes really important. So that's one thing to think about your own home. You know the shower is being used at certain times of day. The cooker is being used at other times of day. And and that is what stacks up. Now the grid has got pinch points and times of the day where it's more tight to capacity. It's typically on a winter's day between maybe 5:00 and 8:00 in the evening.
Caroline Blair:
So also seasonal, of course.
Dave Roberts:
Absolutely. So on a December day around that time, there is less capacity than there is at other times mealtimes. It might be lots of capacity available, but it's quite opaque to you and me as citizens as to what our grid looks like, because actually it's quite opaque, because every every road is different, because we're all different. And the streets that we've gotten power that has been provided isn't just powering homes, it's also providing small businesses. It's powering pubs, it's powering bars, it's powering a whole raft of different economic activities. They'll have peaks at different times. So they're using the energy at different points of the day. And that's where monitoring the grid becomes really quite important.
If we understand when that constraint might start to come in, like pinch points, we can start to nudge behaviour. And ideally we do this in the background fully automated. So you know, you or I as consumers who basically say I want the cheapest time to charge my car as long as it's full, by the time I get up in the morning to go to work, I don't care when you charge. And if the grid is doing its job in the background and it's sending those signals to say don't charge in out cheaper in a bit later on when it was something which is good for the grid, it's good for citizens and it's actually cheaper for people as well. So that's that's the ideal that we're working towards.
Caroline Blair:
It creates an interesting question. I suppose are a point then that there's there's an input here required from the consumer too into, would we say changing behaviours, but perhaps understanding how better to use the networks?
Scott Mathieson:
There’s definitely that. That change. I agree with everything that David said. So we definitely need those tools available to us to soften the curve.
I think there's a really interesting thing happening in terms of the regulatory thought process. And again, without wanting to be too controversial, I would say that we always have a sort of lagging process in terms of funding infrastructure. It's been designed, to make sure that it's efficient and it's low cost and it's effective, and also that it's resilient and good quality as well at the same time.
But that has meant the decision making has typically lagged need. But what we are now seeing is a revolution where we need to have controls to soften the curve as Dave described it, but actually aggregate demand is going to go up. Therefore, we need to invest in the grid simultaneously as well as develop these new tools like flexibility on the grid, where we are able to interact with the customer to allow them to change their behaviour at certain point in time.
It's the consumer that's ultimately driving this revolution as they change what they want to plug into the grid, we must respond to that predictor. And we're also asking for their help as we manage the grid and build out the grid that will satisfy their demand. And I think, you know, that then creates, you described it very well is the sort of biggest opportunity, biggest change and I see it as an opportunity, as did Maynard Keynes after the Second World War. A fairly eminent economist. If we are going to get people, consumer's society out of the situation, the cost-of-living crisis, infrastructure investment that creates jobs and opportunities is a means of doing that. And there's no better business, than networks businesses in creating that opportunities because we need the grid in those local communities and that means we need the employees. We need the businesses like Dave's. We need the research centres like Kathleen’s, and we need more of them than we've ever needed before. I mean, we need manufacturers to come to the UK to help support this as well as, as well as these businesses. We all together need to satisfy that consumer and ultimately societal need.
Caroline Blair:
But you have to spend it also in order to do that, you have to spend to accumulate.
Scott Mathieson:
We do and we've seen a sea change from the has been great recently. In the last two years, we've seen a sea change in approach from a regulator where they have woken up to the fact that actually, if we're going to meet the challenge of climate change, we need to address and build ahead of needs in terms of the electricity network. And they have been given a very important new duty which is relevant to who framed this question. The regulator, for the first time in my thirty year working career has been given a growth duty.
Caroline Blair:
That must be music to your ears.
Scott Mathieson:
And to the end consumer
Caroline Blair:
Absolutely.
Scott Mathieson:
They need to move, we all collectively need to move that the pace of the consumer, that’s what this is about. And address society's needs because consumers reflect that societal need.
Caroline Blair:
Kathleen, do you think that the gaps are being plugged in the way in the right way then? And from what you're seeing and from a research facility, you'll be looking at the holistic picture. You talked about the modelling that you were able to do, for, for the energy companies and for the, for the networks. Are you are you confident that this is a direction of travel in it's the right way to go?
Kathleen Davis:
Absolutely the right way to go. And we've made great progress, I think as well. As Scott mentioned there's cleared investment needed. And I think the magic thought is how we collectively achieve it in the timescales necessary for net zero.
And also the consumer should only feel positive impacts through that. So they should only see improved resilience, improved cost, more control of their energy usage, for example. And I think probably a key enabler of that. And what we are seeing working with our partners is digitalisation, which is great. And I think it's definitely going to accelerate the net zero transition.
However, you mentioned your house being like a tech shop and that's great. That's what we want to hear. But not every household is like that. And I'm from, you know, a working class area of Glasgow. And I think some would be still nervous about smart meters maybe not being the first to adopt heat pumps and electric vehicles. So I think in this transition customer trust will be key to adoption. And I think that's actually a really big barrier that that we need to overcome. We're all champions of net zero right? So maybe finding how to communicate with consumers, not about technology but about those benefits and those positive benefits that they should only see if we if we get it right.
So quite a lot of our programmes are trying to look at, for example, how do we engage consumers, which maybe don't have the connectivity which other households do, or in rural or remote areas where the connectivity is not is great.
Caroline Blair:
I was going to move on to an AI question. I'm going to tease you with that, Dave, for now. But just following on from that, Kathleen to yourself, Scott, do we need to change then perhaps the way we relate to customers too, do we need to look at that?
Scott Mathieson:
Yeah, I absolutely believe, what Kathleen was saying was it really resonates with me. You know, there's a large proportion of society that actually don't really buy into things like flexibility, however much we try. In fact, the retail sector, if you think about it, we created competition in retail, but actually something like 60% of the customer base actually stuck with the existing retailers for long periods of time.
So we do need to engage differently. And I think that means a different contractual relationship with the customer as well. One of the things that I feel really strongly about and passionately about is to make sure that no one gets left behind the in working class areas, and I come from the same type of background that Kathleen has explained as well, that they were able to access electrification of transport.
So one of the projects that we've got that I'm particularly proud of is down at the Caledonian Bus Depot in Glasgow, where the public transport takes most of Glasgow's population to work, a good part of it to its work in any given day, and and to shop as well, working in partnership with them, we were able to do a fund to put an electric bus, a trial into that, that gave them confidence that they now want to put all 300 busses onto an electrified process going forward. We built them a new primary substation to satisfy that demand, and you can walk past and you can see now a fleet of electric busses operating out, keeping the streets of Glasgow a both healthier, safer and more environmentally sound. So that connection with customers needs to be reciprocated.
We're building infrastructure in those communities as well. So we're now beginning to think about how do we make sure that community benefits can be exemplified and delivered, tangibly delivered. And I'm not talking about play parks and village roads. For me it's about how do you create those local jobs, those local opportunities. And when we put a pylon, or a tower as we would describe them, in somebody's local area, they can say that's a really good thing because I can see the jobs in terms of fitting PVs to roofs or EV chargers within that community or the college that locally sits in Dumfries and Galloway, or Coleg Menai in North Wales, that is delivering jobs for people in those communities. Again, making that connection. So I think it's about the it's about the customer relationship, but it's also about the community relationship. If we're really going to crack this.
Kathleen Davis:
Change is inevitable. That is far more palatable. If we can see a tangible benefit and if we can live it and experience it ourselves.
I did, I promise shared a teaser with an AI new question. So, so over to you then, Dave. We were talking there by the digital aspects of this too. I loved your description of challenges being opportunities. This one was potentially a challenge, however though, on this occasion, Dave, because there must be challenges in the digital era with AI, with, I suppose also data capture with retaining. What’s been your experience in that sense?
Dave Roberts:
So I actually see it as a big opportunity. I think AI and technology is there to support us and help us. I mean, firstly, we need to be identifying the right sort of issues and supporting the fix and the right sort of issues. I think we've all we're all quite clear that grids need monitoring, that grids need digitalising. That’s an important aspect. The question is then what data do you need and what data are you trying to use and what are you using that data for. So how is that data going to be utilised. So for example in in the monitoring platforms we've got now we've got machine learning and very clever algorithms that are not just looking at capacity and when demand is available in the in different times of the day and predicting how that might be, we can also start to predict when faults are going to happen.
Caroline Blair:
That’s essential.
Dave Roberts:
Yeah. This is moving away from local fuse has gone, my lights have gone out to can we predict ahead of those events to actually say that circuit is more likely to fault in six months, that one is more likely to fault in a year, that one is more likely to fault in two years. By having that indication ahead of those events that ultimately is providing a more reliable network to us as citizens.
Caroline Blair:
That's surely making your job, Scott, much easier as well? If you can identify if we can pre-empt any weaknesses or any vulnerabilities within the network?
Scott Mathieson:
So yeah, absolutely. And Dave fits in a really good example. So through a products that his business produces, that we utilise, we've been able to create an LV control room. A low voltage control room. Let me just step back a bit to explain who that low voltage network would be touched on earlier, evolved, it was what we would describe as a fit forget. So it was built to the appropriate size and scale to manage any risk on that network, given the level of demand that we saw. And really it could then be planned within a district area that was operating, controlled by the local engineers. They would go, they would inspect it, but we had no active intelligence with respect to what was going on on that grid. A lot of people think that we have full visibility of the network into the home. We don't.
Caroline Blair:
So once it's in, it's in at that point?
Scott Mathieson:
Once it's in, and we know in Britain, we’ve maybe not had the quickest rollout of smart meters. And initially we had a technology that didn't really provide us with the information that we required and that's began to improve. But it doesn't, even now, it doesn't give us everything we need. So the technology that Dave produces for us, which we can put into our substations, the nodes on the network, that where we transform electricity into the energy that goes into the home. To integrate the data that's coming at a smart meter with the capture of the electrical data that's coming out the VisNet and bring that into control means that we are now developing active control of the low voltage network and bringing that all the way into the higher voltages in our control rooms all the way into integrating it over the transmission network for the first time in history of this industry, which is groundbreaking and brilliant, and even more so as we look forward, you know, into the period that we're now seeing in terms of more impacts and resilience. I think Dave touched on it, Kathleen touched on it. One of the key things we need to think about is for you to have all the technology operating in your home, how do we make sure that that's a resilient, secure supply with the weather patterns that we're seeing going forward? And this type of technology can help in that area as well.
Kathleen Davis:
Huge advances clearly have been made. And thanks to yourself, Kathleen, and the work you're doing. And likewise, Dave, it sounds like, you know, there's a huge optimism about the challenge that lies ahead, the opportunity that lies ahead in making those changes that are, yes, both essential, necessary and are coming either way.
I suppose looking at the solution space and if you could wave a magic wand as they would say and if you could make those changes here and now, click of the fingers, starting with yourself, Kathleen, what would it look like?
Kathleen Davis:
I think a lot of technical changes, but one thing I think the sector really needs is a comprehensive global carbon price system. So to really make people innovate and do it naturally, I think if you put a price on carbon or when you have a true cost associated with that, that makes people, it gives them an economic incentive, really, both organisations and individuals, to naturally innovate. So for me, I think that's something that really needs to be considered for everyone to take net zero seriously and for it to be business as usual instead of functions within organisations that are tasked with delivering that. I think AI and using that for a system balancing, the adoption of that, and really accelerating the deployment of that, I think is another key opportunity as well. So how can until intelligently coordinate those storage at scale systems, for example, that Scott mentioned. Or how can we use it for demand side response programmes where we've got the interconnectedness of systems now in the future?
Also, both Dave and Scott mentioned the control centres. So it's going to look quite different to what it looks like now. And actually we'll have a lot of vendors interacting with one another, which hasn't necessarily there's not been a need for that to date. So looking at interoperability of that and AI’s role in that, and trying to advance that is another really key opportunity.
Caroline Blair:
Three really key changes that would make a huge difference. I wonder if there's any crossover to Dave?
Dave Roberts:
There's lots crossover. I think my one word would be accelerate - is the critical thing. I think there's a lots of technologies, lots of solutions out there. I think it's about how they are deployed, at scale on mass.
So we're very proud to have an engineering team, a team that actually designs and builds and manufactures in the UK. So we've got manufacturing partners that are based in the UK that manufacture our kits in different parts of the UK. So the point around we know we need to do decarbonise and digitalise the grid in order to support each other. we know that that requires technology to help that and actually the countries that are fastest out the blocks to decarbonise and digitalise all those that are going to be able to export technology. So actually it becomes very good for UK plc because it gives us much more ability to start to shift from just being service based to being to be able to push for products and other solutions to different parts of the world. And for me, as a supplier into the sector, we see that as a really critical, critical piece.
Caroline Blair:
For the wider commercial too. It's hugely important. So then to round off with yourself then Scott, going back to that magic wand. We've heard some incredible suggestions there and onto you?
Scott Mathieson:
So there’s, I very much used to enjoy Robin Williams. And there's that great film where he's in the boarding school, and he's got the schoolboys lined up in front of the past in.
Caroline Blair:
Dead Poets Society.
Scott Mathieson:
The very one.
And he sneaks up behind them, says, carpe diem, seize the day. There is a unique opportunity, a once in a generation opportunity here for us to grab it. And Dave touched on the need for acceleration. I would say the need to seize that growth opportunity. And that requires a different mindset entrepreneurially within businesses like ours and that's why it's so great to have both Kathleen and Dave here today as well, because they represent the type of businesses that we need to forge this future with us and support us.
That requires us to invest in people. So it's not all going to be solved by AI, because at the end of the day, we still need people to climb those poles, put cross arms on and raise conductors in the air to make sure that network is out there. It requires us to innovate in how we use AI, and we can see the power of that. We can see the revolution that's coming forward and we can see markets investing in that area. We are already beginning to utilise it for the level of renewables that we have got in our businesses, it’s very, very high. We use active network management, which is really AI at the centre of the network. Rather than tripping that generation off, we just pull them back a bit such that the network is healthy and operating and they can still conduct their business.
So there's no doubt for me, it's entrepreneurial spirit needs to be embraced. That growth opportunity ceased. We need to invest in the people, the army of people. Half a million jobs required in the next 10 to 20 years in this industry. What an opportunity across all our area and making sure that we are investing in intelligent systems that can help us through this revolution in terms of energy networks.
Caroline Blair:
Well, if this is a once in a generational transformation, as we're saying, it sounds like it's certainly something to be embraced. Thank you so much for your time today. To Scott, to Kathleen, and to Dave as well. And thanks to you for tuning in to this, the first episode of Powering Conversations. We hope you enjoyed this episode and gained some valuable insights into the incredible evolution of the electricity network.
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